tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post491034704564164908..comments2023-08-25T16:13:51.356+01:00Comments on Martin In The Margins: The dangers of politics as faithMartinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15608932251584881007noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-15940662625540728682008-10-18T17:07:00.000+01:002008-10-18T17:07:00.000+01:00Very interesting post, the way that faith in a pol...Very interesting post, the way that faith in a political belief can be similar to faith in a religious belief is something that fascinates me. Particularly where religious faith is criticised for being irrational yet faith in a political philosophy is allowed to override the requirement for rational explanation.Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08204174267833645562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-83202026662839088442008-10-18T09:13:00.000+01:002008-10-18T09:13:00.000+01:00The C S Lewis quote is interesting, and is certain...The C S Lewis quote is interesting, and is certainly a reminder of a particular strain in religious writing on politics - one which focuses on human fallibility and is therefore suspicious of utopian political projects. It's a theme in the work of Jean Bethke Elshtain, whose work I admire - and she in turn was influenced by the work of Reinhold Niebuhr (about whose political writings there's an interesting piece in the latest LRB). Interesting that all of these - Lewis, Elshtain, Niebuhr - are Protestants - and Protestantism has always had a keener sense of human sinfulness and limitation than Catholicism. Maybe it's why left-wing Catholics, more than Protestants, have been more attracted to the grand, systemic, utopian versions of socialism/progressivism (after all, it was a Catholic who invented the word 'utopia'). But even as I write this, I can think of exceptions on both sides...so there's no hard and fast rule, no straight line from a particular theology to a particular kind of politics. The Jewish experience is probably even more complex but commenting on it is probably, as Obama would say, above my pay grade.Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15608932251584881007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-30851896225025115692008-10-16T21:27:00.000+01:002008-10-16T21:27:00.000+01:00'Illusory perfectionism' captures it beautifully. ...'Illusory perfectionism' captures it beautifully. But surely you needn't be pessimistic about it: no doubt it does taint religiously-inspired politics, but it also taints secular politics, as you point out. And the idealism and moralism which you see as a basis for this perfectionism aren't peculiar to the religious temperament - they may take a religious form, but they needn't. Their presence isn't sufficient for religious politics, and it isn't necessary either, since religious politics needn't be purist. Didn't C.S.Lewis say somewhere that it was precisely because he believed that human nature was fallen and sinful that he was a democrat - our nature is too corruptible for it to be safe to give too much power to any individual?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-64561219906162892182008-10-16T16:49:00.001+01:002008-10-16T16:49:00.001+01:00This comment has been removed by the author.Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15608932251584881007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-33323823903899425772008-10-16T16:49:00.000+01:002008-10-16T16:49:00.000+01:00Thanks for the comment, Eve. Despite some similari...Thanks for the comment, Eve. Despite some similarities, I think the 'purism' of left wing and right wing believers is somewhat different. The right tends to be obsessed with bodily (and by extension racial) purity, whereas the left tends to seek purity of the idea and of motive. But probably both are based on an illusory perfectionism. In my more pessimistic (and secularist) moments, I wonder if this kind of tendency inevitably taints any kind of religiously-inspired politics...Martinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15608932251584881007noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4318375667051435937.post-90447135057974858132008-10-15T23:39:00.000+01:002008-10-15T23:39:00.000+01:00Interesting post, Martin, especially your comments...Interesting post, Martin, especially your comments on the attraction of purity to certain kinds of leftwinger. It might be instructive to compare that conception of purity with the analogous right-wing version. These desires to be free from all taint or compromise are always a bit worrying.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com